Curse

zwei2stein · May 16, 2008, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Perhabs it is subconsious way of market removing huge excess of items that would trully clog it.

Moloch Vein · May 16, 2008, 05:49 PM // 17:49

I own and use quite a few q6 items. For example my assassin frequently uses a A/W build specced at 12-11-6 with a q6 tactics shield. There are situations where a low req, 9 or even lower is most desirable.

Johny bravo · May 16, 2008, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Take a Conjure Warrior. Every point he can put into his elemental attribute he get essentially +0.75 to his DPS so for the points it take to get from say 9-10 you could get almost +2 points to your DPS where as the skill effect you would get from the increae from 9-10 is most likely minimal (recharge, break point ...). Another thing to consider is shields, do you want to spec 12 or 13 into tactics or strength, maybe, maybe not.

For casters it doesn't matter as much although for your weapon but I think the base energy you get from your focus is effected by you attribute.

Most of the time I think it is mostly a status thing, but there are cases where it makes a difference.

cebalrai · May 16, 2008, 06:01 PM // 18:01

Since weapons all do the same thing in this game, people make up stuff to differentiate.

A r9 fire staff is worth a few plats while a r12 one is junk. Meanwhile 99.9% of fire eles have a fire attribute much higher than 12. The entire economy is based on vanity and not function so this really shouldn't surprise anyone...

Martin Alvito · May 16, 2008, 06:04 PM // 18:04

When this criticism comes up, it almost invariably is addressed towards Warrior weapons. Yes, for 99% of all Warrior applications (and 100% of all PvP applications), the req doesn't matter. Unless you are solo farming or your monks are terrible (compelling a serious anti-damage build), your Warrior wants to maximize damage output, which implies high weapon mastery. Similarly, Elementalist casters aren't likely to care much about req.

Hey, guess what? Other classes don't work like that.

Rangers frequently do not wish to spec heavily into Marksmanship, in order to do their true "job" (spread conditions/spam spirits/interrupt/etc.) more effectively.

The damage from extra points into skills frequently outweighs that from an extra point or two in Dagger Mastery, because the base damage on daggers is garbage. Therefore, if you're running a build with a lot of Critical Strikes attack skills, you often maximize damage output by keeping Dagger Mastery low and maximizing Critical Strikes.

Points put into hitting a shield's requirement are often wasted (often you only have one skill on the bar from that attribute line), so low req shields are desirable.

Often times, you want to weapon swap between different 20/20 sets if you're on a Mesmer, Monk or Necro. Guess what? It's important that you be able to hit the req, at least on the focus, in order to be able to cast! Having six energy disappear from your pool unplanned is rarely a good thing.

In short, there are practical reasons to want low req weapons, depending on how you play and what you do. If all you do is hop into RA with wiki builds and scream "NOOBZ" at people, odds are that a req 13 weapon will be fine. If you're a bit more sophisticated about what you do, and you care about wringing the last bit of performance out of every bar you build, eventually req is going to matter, and you're better off paying for it up front when you get the weapon in the first place than realizing later that you're going to need req 7/8/9 in order to play a specific bar.

imnotyourmother · May 16, 2008, 06:44 PM // 18:44

Well let me add my 2 cents.

I mostly play in 2 areas of the game. GWEN killing snow wurms for lots of gold items and in pre-searing.

In Hard mode there is almost no difference in using a max sword req9 or req13 on my war.

However there is a HUGE difference using my sword 10-14 damage Rindblade (+5 Armor vrs Charr) in Pre. My shield is req3 in tac and I am trying to put every last attribute point into the strength and into swordsmanship so that I can hit harder with my sword.

Example, with strength at 10 I hit the oaks for 98 damage (most of the time). But with strength at 9 I only hit for 82 damage (most of the time) WITH THE SAME SWORD. (armor pen + or - 1%)

So You do more damage with the sword in pre at least with the attribute points set higher. SO the higher the better even with the same sword.

Try this yourself if you have a war.

So if I could get a req2 tac shield with armor +10 like I have I will snatch it in a heartbeat so that I can get my sword to do more damage. That is a big swing considering that I am lvl 16.

So for a war the attribute points do more damage output by the weapon that they have. so req9 or the super rare req7 lets me put more points into Strength that lets my war do way more damage.

So for my rune requirement of strength at 13 to get +20 armor vrs elemental damage that costs me 91 of my possible 170 attribute points or 200 if I have done those extra quests to get the additional attribute points. (not everyone know about these quests.)

so my sword is req9 and that is 45 attribute points. That leaves me with 34 attribute points for my secondary prof healing prayers.

so a max of 7 in that attribute.

If I add runes that do not subtract heath, generally a bad idea for a tank I can add +1 to the strength and the sword. The rest is crud for a war.

So that gives me back 13 points from strength maintaining the 13 for the rune and 9 from the swordsmanship leaving me with 21 more or 51 more.

So with 55 or 85 more attribute points I can get another 2% armor penetration and 11 in my sword.

So, the req is way more than just the fame factor. It makes you stronger as you can put more attribute points into your SECONDARY PROFESSION.

This is what makes you strong as most everyone runs the same PRIMARY build, but the great strength is in the attribute points of the Secondary Profession.

Example I have a hero that has a dragon's breath wand req9 with an off hand req9 BOTH in FIRE. So I only have to use 15 attribute points to max out my weapons SET. My headgear is fire and I use a sup rune of fire. That leaves me 185 attribute points for my Secondary profession. How sweet is that with only a -75 health sacrifice???

I think that is right on the way the attribute points stack. If I am wrong you get the idea of the thing.

Savio · May 16, 2008, 07:01 PM // 19:01

People have lots of money and nothing important to spend it on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by imnotyourmother

So for a war the attribute points do more damage output by the weapon that they have. so req9 or the super rare req7 lets me put more points into Strength that lets my war do way more damage.
...
So, the req is way more than just the fame factor. It makes you stronger as you can put more attribute points into your SECONDARY PROFESSION.

Adding one level to your weapon attribute adds more damage than adding one level to strength. And healing prayers is crap on a warrior.

Wild Karrde · May 16, 2008, 07:36 PM // 19:36

I run 14 weapon mastery on my warrior at all times cause I like doing damage and beating things faces in, so Im fine with buying a cheap R 10-12 weapon with a nice skin.

On my ranger I can at least one green that will fit my needs, and if not I splurge a little on a nice lower req weapon, cause I dont run high marks a whole lot.

On my rit I have greens and some golds..... BMP weapons are my friend.\

So I dont care what req a weapon is as long as I can use it. R9 or lower is just to make your epeen bigger. And Seeing that my Rit, Ranger, and War are my only PvE toons (deleted all the rest got bored with em.) I just make a PvP toon for any other situation.

cgruber · May 16, 2008, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

People have lots of money and nothing important to spend it on.

Adding one level to your weapon attribute adds more damage than adding one level to strength. And healing prayers is crap on a warrior.

Agree. GW dmg is about doing critical hits, higher wep mastery = greater chance of inflicting a critical hit. Strength just increases your chance of armor pent which will increase dmg slightly.

Mork from Ork · May 16, 2008, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

People have lots of money and nothing important to spend it on.

That's pretty much your answer right there. With all the golds dropping in HM and from chests every skin eventually clogs the available market and drops in price sooner or later. So, if you have the money to spend, might as well buy the best and merch the rest even if r9 is functionally little different for your build than r12.

Turbobusa · May 16, 2008, 10:38 PM // 22:38

The only time I needed a req 9 was on a backbreaker sin...
It's the <10 breakpoint, looks nicer on the weapon's stats

lorph · May 16, 2008, 11:29 PM // 23:29

I think this is a big deal. Arena net has messed up the pvp aspect of the game with req 7 items. For example PvE monks are still superior to PvP, because they can easily spec 7 into tactics and get the full 16 armor on a shield. Speccing 9 tactics when you could do 7 is a major penalty

I wouldn't be surprised if people in pvp are still abusing the +14-15% unconditional, no drawbacks, damage items that they never bothered to delete.

And yes they do make a difference. I can't tell you how many times I've been left with 1-5 hp after getting a heal.

Dante the Warlord · May 16, 2008, 11:52 PM // 23:52

IMHO i think that any req (in terms of your weapon) can go up to req 13, since you should be at max there anyways. Offhands on the other hand, particulary shields should be a low req, since you generally need to adjust them all the time.

lutz · May 16, 2008, 11:57 PM // 23:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by randomperson

The exception would be bows- most PvP ranger builds have 10 in marksmanship, so req 11 (accounting for weakness) would be the lowest you could go without gimping yourself.

Otherwise it's the rarity.

Cripshots have 9 in Marks, 10 after rune. So you need a r9 for after weakness.

-Loki- · May 17, 2008, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by miskav

The req's only affect that's next to them, plain and simple.

It's amazing how many people still don't understand this.

Ben-A-BoO · May 17, 2008, 02:40 AM // 02:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

Cripshots have 9 in Marks, 10 after rune. So you need a r9 for after weakness.

Well you won't deal any significant amount of damage even if you fulfill the requirement while suffering from weakness. Although I follow the same rule of thump.

Requirements mainly matter on shields (and to a certain extent offhands) since they are linked to your primary attribute, which is in fact most often the secondary attribute that you spec in. Any shield above req 9 is of no use to me since it hinders me in build selection. That explains also why inscribable req7 15 armor shields have become so popular lately for stance monks and paragons.

-Loki- · May 17, 2008, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by timebandit

Well you won't deal any significant amount of damage even if you fulfill the requirement while suffering from weakness. Although I follow the same rule of thump.

You're dealing almost no damage anyway as a cripshot. That's not the point of the build. Spreading degen and crippling targets is, as well as interruption.

LifeInfusion · May 17, 2008, 03:12 AM // 03:12

no reason to use anything worse than collector's/pvp equipment (req9).

Also, req9 is 1 digit while anything above is 2 digits (lengthens weapon description).

Striker IV · May 17, 2008, 03:40 AM // 03:40

This is only partly true for weapons, but false for offhadns/shiedls.

wait,... meanign i have been throwing away shields that are req12 and whatnot because i thought they lessen the amount of armor i woud recieve having 0 points in the mastery

ie monk with a req 12 shield

do i still get the 8 armor regardless of the requirements needed to get 16?

kooomar · May 17, 2008, 05:21 AM // 05:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Striker IV

This is only partly true for weapons, but false for offhadns/shiedls.

wait,... meanign i have been throwing away shields that are req12 and whatnot because i thought they lessen the amount of armor i woud recieve having 0 points in the mastery

ie monk with a req 12 shield

do i still get the 8 armor regardless of the requirements needed to get 16?

Someone correct me if Im wrong, but if you dont meet the req on the shield, NO MATTER WHAT, you get half of its armor, even for an armor 14 req6, youd only get 7 armor.

But for offhands, the amount of energy you get tiers up as you get more points into the req.